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Just had Pilot Road 5 Trail tires mounted on my 2018 R1200GS at Cross Country in Metuchen NJ and will let you all know how they are once I actually get out on the road! Cross Country's prices were great and I know we were waiting for the trails in our size and they are out! Nice tires, and I will keep you all up to date.
 

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Dunlop

Looking forward to your wear report!

I fitted Dunlop Trail Smarts in November on my '17 GSA. Got about 1800 miles on them now and they are wearing faster than i expected. I blew the OEM Anakees up at 5k miles, then shod some Michelin PR4 GTs for the ride to Iowa and back last summer. They lasted about 6k miles. I am really considering Heidenau K60s. My buddy gets 15k on his '09 GSA consistently. Hard to beat that!
 

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Looking forward to your wear report!

I fitted Dunlop Trail Smarts in November on my '17 GSA. Got about 1800 miles on them now and they are wearing faster than i expected. I blew the OEM Anakees up at 5k miles, then shod some Michelin PR4 GTs for the ride to Iowa and back last summer. They lasted about 6k miles. I am really considering Heidenau K60s. My buddy gets 15k on his '09 GSA consistently. Hard to beat that!
If you are looking at the Heidenau K60's I would recommend the Mitas E-07+ . The Heidenau are extremely loud . The Mitas are much quieter and perform better on and off road. I pulled the Heidenau's off at 6000 miles because they had lost there feel and were driving me crazy with the noise. I just turned 9000 miles on the Mitas and the rear needs replaced. The front is still in good shape but I always replace both together.
 

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Looking forward to your wear report!

I fitted Dunlop Trail Smarts in November on my '17 GSA. Got about 1800 miles on them now and they are wearing faster than i expected. I blew the OEM Anakees up at 5k miles, then shod some Michelin PR4 GTs for the ride to Iowa and back last summer. They lasted about 6k miles. I am really considering Heidenau K60s. My buddy gets 15k on his '09 GSA consistently. Hard to beat that!
My pet peeves about motorcycle tire threads:
Why, judging from threads about tires, is it that at any, correction, every, given instant while riding a motorcycle, the most important concerns about the bike’s tires that the rider has are whether the tires will grip the road or slide away and whether the tires are making control of the bike difficult, in other words, grip and handling. Yet, once the ride is over and the time comes to consider new tires, the most important criteria for making that decision are not grip or handling, but how many miles one can go before having to make that decision again.
With rare exception, posts on motorcycle forum threads about tires begin and, all too often also end, with only a report about how many miles the poster was able to coax out of the particular brand and model of tires the poster was reporting on before the tires were totally worn out.
I don’t mean to pick on this particular poster or his post, but the post is a classic example of a typical post about what tires are the best for a particular motorcycle starting with its title “Looking forward to your WEAR report.” The post informs about how many miles the poster and others were able to go on different models of tires as the basis for recommending that readers make their choices for their next sets of tires without even a glancing mention anywhere in the post about how well those models gripped the road or handled in any situation.
For me, while I would like to know whether a particular model of tire wears unduly faster than others, that is the least of the criteria that I use to choose what tires I will risk my life and limb riding on and/or what tires will give me the most enjoyment while they are on my bike. But rarely do posts in tire threads address these criteria.
It never happens in other contexts that a motorcyclist will brag about how gingerly he/she was able to ride a twisty road or highway or how slowly one is able to twist his/her throttle or apply his/her brakes when riding; the things that make it possible for the rider to get the most miles out of a set of tires before the wear bars show. Yet, when it comes to tire threads, all too many of
those who post can’t wait to brag about the number of miles they were able to get from their favorite choice of tire. I, for one, find such posts to be useless except for the humor that they be provide in that I can’t help but read them as saying. “Forget all those tall tales that I have been spinning about how aggressively I ride, the truth is, I ride like a 95 year old grandma, as the fantastically unbelievable number of miles I’m perfectly willing to disclose to you without shame or embarrassment I was able to get out of my tires attests.”
Then, there is the flip side of such posts: those whose writers have figured out that reporting on miles one gets out of one’s tire tells readers about the riding style of the poster: these posters can’t wait to report how few miles they get: “ I had a set of Trailblazer O76s on my bike. They wore so fast that I had to turn around on my trip home from the installer to get new tires.”
Really, is anyone buying either kind of BS?
To me, the truth of the matter is that whoever you are and however you ride, you can expect to get somewhere between 5,000 and 7,000 miles from a set of street tires on an R1200GS or GSA; somewhat less for off road or partial off road tires. Many factors account for these vaiences, not just the quality or design of the tires. The real differences in brands and models come in how they grip, how they handle, how quickly they loose their profile, how much confidence they instill in the rider because of these factors, how noisy or quiet they are. That’s what I want to know when I read a tire thread.
Am I alone in this thinking?
 

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... Am I alone in this thinking?
So much, this^!

Well put, LAS. I don't care about longevity, and would only consider it as a primary attribute if embarking on a very very long ride - in which case it may rise near the top of things to consider. If you're doing a RTW ride (and I don't suspect I ever would because it doesn't appeal to me), then longevity matters. Otherwise, we're riding around on $20K USD motorcycles. We should be able to afford new good tires whenever they wear out. When I rode around on a $4K motorcycle, I could afford good tires whenever they began to wear out. The only thing that interfaces with the ground when motorcycling are a couple of credit-card sized contact patches. I want them grippy more than I want them to last 12K miles. If i have to spend a couple of hundred bucks every 5-7K miles, that's not a big deal, no matter how cheap you are - and if it is, maybe one should consider whether or not they should be/can afford to ride.

I still like reading other peoples opinions on tires, and I wonder how they heck they last so long for other people. I guess I ride too hard, but I wouldn't have it any other way. >:)

Pun intended: YMMV! :grin2:
 
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So much, this^
...The only thing that interfaces with the ground when motorcycling are a couple of credit-card sized contact patches. I want them grippy more than I want them to last 12K miles.

Pun intended: YMMV! :grin2:
Agree, Se8r, with the exception that the size of the contact patch of a properly inflated motorcycle street tire is actually not much bigger than a US quarter. Scary that!
 

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Agree, Se8r, with the exception that the size of the contact patch of a properly inflated motorcycle street tire is actually not much bigger than a US quarter. Scary that!
I will disagree with you on that. Park your muddy GS outside on pavement overnight in the rain. If it is dry the next morning, you will clearly see the print of your tire on the pavement as you pull away. It is far greater than a US quarter; I'd agree with the credit card statement at least for my Anakee III's I had at the time. And yes, they were properly inflated to street riding pressures.

To your comments about tires, mileage is the only metric that people can quantify. I feel that is why they are so many are willing to write about it. It's tangible to the author. They can feel safe that what they are reporting is real. Everything else is strictly qualitative and transforming that into words can be difficult. Forum trolls may keep people from posting qualitative reviews. (Let's face it, forums aren't exactly the nicest sand box to play in at times.)

I've never taken what anyone has said on a tire post as law. Unless you have a G meter on your bike or show video grinding pegs, how can you take what anyone says with worth? Ones idea of grip/slip/noise/feel may vary greatly from yours. We all ride at our own pace and I don't know any of you. So why would I trust what you say about a tires characteristics? The locals I ride with, I'm more inclined to trust what they qualitatively say because I see how they ride. If you're looking to forums of strangers for qualitative feedback on what is arguably the most important piece of equipment on your bike, you may be going down the wrong road. Am I alone in this thinking? :wink2:

While I, too, average ~5k miles from ANY rear tire, I consider myself one of the "I ride like grandma" crowd. I flaunt those chicken stripes with pride. :grin2: Corners aren't the fun for me; I enjoy the landscape I'm riding through, the streams I can cross, and the places I journey to. I'm glad I can fuel your humor. :laugh2:
 
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I will disagree with you on that. Park your muddy GS outside on pavement overnight in the rain. If it is dry the next morning, you will clearly see the print of your tire on the pavement as you pull away. It is far greater than a US quarter; I'd agree with the credit card statement at least for my Anakee III's I had at the time. And yes, they were properly inflated to street riding pressures.

To your comments about tires, mileage is the only metric that people can quantify. I feel that is why they are so many are willing to write about it. It's tangible to the author. They can feel safe that what they are reporting is real. Everything else is strictly qualitative and transforming that into words can be difficult. Forum trolls may keep people from posting qualitative reviews. (Let's face it, forums aren't exactly the nicest sand box to play in at times.)

I've never taken what anyone has said on a tire post as law. Unless you have a G meter on your bike or show video grinding pegs, how can you take what anyone says with worth? Ones idea of grip/slip/noise/feel may vary greatly from yours. We all ride at our own pace and I don't know any of you. So why would I trust what you say about a tires characteristics? The locals I ride with, I'm more inclined to trust what they qualitatively say because I see how they ride. If you're looking to forums of strangers for qualitative feedback on what is arguably the most important piece of equipment on your bike, you may be going down the wrong road. Am I alone in this thinking? :wink2:

While I, too, average ~5k miles from ANY rear tire, I consider myself one of the "I ride like grandma" crowd. I flaunt those chicken stripes with pride. :grin2: Corners aren't the fun for me; I enjoy the landscape I'm riding through, the streams I can cross, and the places I journey to. I'm glad I can fuel your humor. :laugh2:
If you can’t trust what people post about tire characteristics because you don’t know the people, why would you trust what they say about tire mileage? I do agree that one should not rely on any single post of someone who one does not know. I also agree that tire characteristics are difficult to quantify and that perceptions of different people as to them may vary making them less than scientifically accurate. However, that is true for most things in life that people rate, yet ratings are made and reliable when considered en masse. That is to say, if everyone on Yelp pans a restaurant, it’s probably not a good restaurant. If all but one person reports that the food at a restaurant is top notch and the one claims that it is tasteless, you can be fairly confident that the one is not a reliable source and that generally the food at the restaurant is good.
You and the OP may be right about the size of a contact patch on a motorcycle depending on whether the bike is upright, leaned over, under throttle or brake, the type of tire, etc. As I understand it, the shape is actually oblong when the bike is upright and stationary. In your example the bike was stationary. Was it on the kickstand?
 

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Agree, Se8r, with the exception that the size of the contact patch of a properly inflated motorcycle street tire is actually not much bigger than a US quarter. Scary that!
Umm... no. You can easily compute the contact patch area by taking the weight of the motorcycle (including rider and gear) and dividing by tire pressure. So, for example, my GS, with my fat butt on the saddle, will come in at around 750 pounds. Figure an average of 38psi in the tires (a bit less up front, a bit more in the rear), and you get just shy of 20 square inches of contact patch. I suspect front and rear contact patches are almost exactly the same size, as the the typically lower front pressure is offset by the slightly less weight on the front tire.
 

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If you can’t trust what people post about tire characteristics because you don’t know the people, why would you trust what they say about tire mileage? I do agree that one should not rely on any single post of someone who one does not know. I also agree that tire characteristics are difficult to quantify and that perceptions of different people as to them may vary making them less than scientifically accurate. However, that is true for most things in life that people rate, yet ratings are made and reliable when considered en masse. That is to say, if everyone on Yelp pans a restaurant, it’s probably not a good restaurant. If all but one person reports that the food at a restaurant is top notch and the one claims that it is tasteless, you can be fairly confident that the one is not a reliable source and that generally the food at the restaurant is good.
You and the OP may be right about the size of a contact patch on a motorcycle depending on whether the bike is upright, leaned over, under throttle or brake, the type of tire, etc. As I understand it, the shape is actually oblong when the bike is upright and stationary. In your example the bike was stationary. Was it on the kickstand?
Until there is a Yelp for tires app... :grin2: I, personally, won't trust the mileage either. I was stating it more from people that are willing to post about tires would be more inclined to post mileage over qualitative as it is a real number they can trust.

And my bike was on the center stand. The tire left a nice, crisp, oval contact patch. A CC is ~7.5sq. in. and I'd say that's about the size of it.

We totally hi-jacked this thread. :frown2:
 
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Until there is a Yelp for tires app... :grin2: I, personally, won't trust the mileage either. I was stating it more from people that are willing to post about tires would be more inclined to post mileage over qualitative as it is a real number they can trust.

And my bike was on the center stand. The tire left a nice, crisp, oval contact patch. A CC is ~7.5sq. in. and I'd say that's about the size of it.

We totally hi-jacked this thread. :frown2:
Can’t argue with you on any of that, including the unintended thread hijack, for which I apologize to the OP.
 

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This is the contact patch from a Dunlop Roadsmart 2. Not all brands are like this but it is the reason I keep buying Dunlop.
After I posted my now concededly erroneous comment about contact patch size and saw another post critical of it on this thread, I went to the net to find out if the other posts were correct and found the Dunlop illustration that you posted. I tried to add it to my post but couldn’t get it done. You obviously have better skills than I do in that regard!
 

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My pet peeves about motorcycle tire threads:
Why, judging from threads about tires, is it that at any, correction, every, given instant while riding a motorcycle, the most important concerns about the bike’s tires that the rider has are whether the tires will grip the road or slide away and whether the tires are making control of the bike difficult, in other words, grip and handling. Yet, once the ride is over and the time comes to consider new tires, the most important criteria for making that decision are not grip or handling, but how many miles one can go before having to make that decision again.
With rare exception, posts on motorcycle forum threads about tires begin and, all too often also end, with only a report about how many miles the poster was able to coax out of the particular brand and model of tires the poster was reporting on before the tires were totally worn out.
I don’t mean to pick on this particular poster or his post, but the post is a classic example of a typical post about what tires are the best for a particular motorcycle starting with its title “Looking forward to your WEAR report.” The post informs about how many miles the poster and others were able to go on different models of tires as the basis for recommending that readers make their choices for their next sets of tires without even a glancing mention anywhere in the post about how well those models gripped the road or handled in any situation.
For me, while I would like to know whether a particular model of tire wears unduly faster than others, that is the least of the criteria that I use to choose what tires I will risk my life and limb riding on and/or what tires will give me the most enjoyment while they are on my bike. But rarely do posts in tire threads address these criteria.
It never happens in other contexts that a motorcyclist will brag about how gingerly he/she was able to ride a twisty road or highway or how slowly one is able to twist his/her throttle or apply his/her brakes when riding; the things that make it possible for the rider to get the most miles out of a set of tires before the wear bars show. Yet, when it comes to tire threads, all too many of
those who post can’t wait to brag about the number of miles they were able to get from their favorite choice of tire. I, for one, find such posts to be useless except for the humor that they be provide in that I can’t help but read them as saying. “Forget all those tall tales that I have been spinning about how aggressively I ride, the truth is, I ride like a 95 year old grandma, as the fantastically unbelievable number of miles I’m perfectly willing to disclose to you without shame or embarrassment I was able to get out of my tires attests.”
Then, there is the flip side of such posts: those whose writers have figured out that reporting on miles one gets out of one’s tire tells readers about the riding style of the poster: these posters can’t wait to report how few miles they get: “ I had a set of Trailblazer O76s on my bike. They wore so fast that I had to turn around on my trip home from the installer to get new tires.”
Really, is anyone buying either kind of BS?
To me, the truth of the matter is that whoever you are and however you ride, you can expect to get somewhere between 5,000 and 7,000 miles from a set of street tires on an R1200GS or GSA; somewhat less for off road or partial off road tires. Many factors account for these vaiences, not just the quality or design of the tires. The real differences in brands and models come in how they grip, how they handle, how quickly they loose their profile, how much confidence they instill in the rider because of these factors, how noisy or quiet they are. That’s what I want to know when I read a tire thread.
Am I alone in this thinking?
Depends on your usage. I'll do more than 30k miles this year, I want tire life, and to not have pavement handling suck too badly. I just put Road 5 Trails on my 2005 GS, we'll see how that works out.

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Depends on your usage. I'll do more than 30k miles this year, I want tire life, and to not have pavement handling suck too badly. I just put Road 5 Trails on my 2005 GS, we'll see how that works out.

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I will also do more than 30K miles this year; and I want all of them to be on tires that perform well-that is, they grip in the conditions that I predominantly ride in and make handling the bike in those conditions easy and, therefor, enjoyable. For reasons of safety and fun, I will gladly take tires off my bikes sooner rather than ride on them when grip and performance is compromised just because there is tread life left. For the same reasons, I will also put tires on my bike with principal strengths of good grip and handling over tires with the principal strength of long tread life.
That I put as many miles behind me on a motorcycle is more, not less, reason to want tires that grip and handle well throughout their life even if their life is not as long as other tires that get great wear but loose their profiles early.
This said, I would make a concession to longer wear if I was planning a trip predominantly on slab in excess of 5,000 miles. On such a trip, even the worst performing tires these days will perform well enough and it would be easier for me if I didn’t have to have to make a change mid trip. However, I don’t see myself on that kind of trip as that would not be my idea of a fun trip. For trips that I do enjoy and will take, if the trip will exceed 5,000 miles, it’s likely that somewhere along the way, there will be a shop that can change my tires while I rest for an hour or two, get a bite to eat. Probably, the same place where I would get an oil change.
Good luck with the new tires. I’m interested to know how they perform. Hopefully, they will give both performance and long life.
 

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Update on my Road 5 Trail after month and a few thousand miles, liking them so far, not done any serious canyon carving, but aside from a little weirdness as you start to lean over, I've been quite happy. Plenty of the life left. Would not want to try them off road!

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Discussion Starter #18 (Edited)
Wow this thread went sideways. You guys take this Internet sharing stuff way too seriously.

Now, for the update on the tires. 2,000+ miles on them and I LOVE them.

Grip: Much more grip than the Anakee 3 tires and before one of you flame me I know the A3’s are supposed to be on/off road. Stupid me went out the first weekend I got them (first ride fresh out of the box with all the mold release etc still on them) on Sunday morning 10 degrees and black ice all over the place. I mean I was stupid going out. Even though I made a bad choice the tires saved my butt. Big time. In 60 degree weather they are GREAT and they love the twisties on the R1200GS. Actually in all temps they are great even on ice at 40+ mph.

Rain: I am not the best person to rate this as I am a cautious rider in the rain (obviously not the ice). I did not have an issue with either tire in the rain and I have ridden quiet often in the rain on both.

Noise: Much less. Much much less noise than the A3’s. They are very quite tires.

Vibration: They win here as well over the A3’s. The vibration I was getting at all speeds but certainly around 75mph is far less.

Stability: Once in a while I felt the A3’s grabbing lines or tar strips in the road but it was not overly concerning. I have not felt that in the pilot 5 trials.

Wear: I really don’t care (sorry guys). If you do you would have cried if you saw how much rubber was left in the A3’s when they went in the bin. That being said they look like they are wearing much less than the A3’s at 2k miles. Subjective I know.

Hope this helps someone, if not it’s more bits in the Internet bucket.

Best
 

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Update on my Road 5 Trail after month and a few thousand miles, liking them so far, not done any serious canyon carving, but aside from a little weirdness as you start to lean over, I've been quite happy. Plenty of the life left. Would not want to try them off road!

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Finally, been waiting for an update. This threads been off somewhere having a "moment". I managed to keep skipping it all while looking for this. So if I may, what exactly do you mean by "a little weirdness"
Aannnnd why are you not up for "any" off road with them. I mean I can see there isn't much aggression there but I've done some reasonable trails on road tires. They're of no use to me with zero ability. Lemmi know if you do end up on the trail and thanks for the update.
 

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Finally, been waiting for an update. This threads been off somewhere having a "moment". I managed to keep skipping it all while looking for this. So if I may, what exactly do you mean by "a little weirdness"

Aannnnd why are you not up for "any" off road with them. I mean I can see there isn't much aggression there but I've done some reasonable trails on road tires. They're of no use to me with zero ability. Lemmi know if you do end up on the trail and thanks for the update.
Well, if you compare the tread pattern with the Road 5, I don't see much if any difference. They make 3 more dirt oriented tire series than these. As to the weirdness, it's just a little bit of wiggle at about as hard a turn as you get on a freeway at speeds that won't get you a ticket, I think it's from the transition to the grippy compound on the sides of the tread. If I were cornering hard and it did that, it would bother me, but it doesn't matter because I'm no where near my or the bikes limits. I've gone off pavement a few miles, didn't like sand at all ;-) but I don't know what I'm doing.

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