Anyone using a Bluetooth intercom? Pros/Cons? Trying to figure out what is best for me.
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
Krisairxn
I have been running Cardo Scala Riders for years. First started using them for off road ATV setups. They have always "worked" for me but as you will soon find out nobody makes a 'perfect' wireless helmet com setup. Nobody. Which is really a shame.
The real limiting factor with self contained helmet wireless systems is the battery life. Too loud and they use too much power hence short battery life, not to mention they deafen you. Not loud enough, and you end up buying amplifiers, blowing speaker drivers, and cobbling things up trying to 'tune' them. That's the biggest gotcha out there. And quite honestly it's hard for me to advise here based on second hand knowledge, and that leads me into the second biggest gotcha with helmet com systems... speaker placement. I can't tell you how many reviews I've read where people are bitching about the scala riders not being loud enough. I learned early on that most, if not all of those folks just didn't have the speakers positioned right. One big contributing factor here is the helmets with pre-formed speaker recesses in the EPS foam liners. Those are crap. Even my 700$ Arai has them...and they suck. Not only are they not positioned right for my ear holes, they are recessed which means the speakers are not even farther away from my ears. Get a pair of head phones, and pull the cups even 1/8 of an inch away from your ears and listen to the difference.
If you get ANY setup, get anal with the speaker positioning, and make sure they are fastened down inside with some foam behind them to push them ever so gently into contact with your ears...dead center over your earholes. Mounting the ear pieces is the most misunderstood, under estimated part of the whole deal. Don't let someone else do it for you, don't settle for it's good enough, you have to get it dead right, and make sure it's secure enough that putting the helmet on and off won't eventually move them out of place... and DON'T let them push too hard into your ears because they will feel great for about 20 minutes. Just long enough to get on the highway, then they will start to kill you.
So lastly, I'll say the cardo's have done ok by me. I have 5 sets currently. My wife has them in her helmet, and my son has them in his. I also have about 2 generations back g4's, G9's and G9X. The fancy voice activation sucks. The bells and whistles are crap. Basic pair to phone, GPS, and eachother is randy, so don't expect ease of use. But generally speaking, once they are setup, they are setup. Starting G9's you have pc based setup apps and now even a phone app, which I admit, is nice. But at the end of the day, the g4's were fine.
Whatever you buy break your ass to get the mounting done right. Take the extra time to measure your earspots however you see fit, and know that you won't get it right the first time.I'm still trying to perfect the process. I wish someone offered a head molding process to get custom foam cheek pads formed with speaker pockets done right but alas, I'm probably 5 years ahead of the curve with that idea.
The real limiting factor with self contained helmet wireless systems is the battery life. Too loud and they use too much power hence short battery life, not to mention they deafen you. Not loud enough, and you end up buying amplifiers, blowing speaker drivers, and cobbling things up trying to 'tune' them. That's the biggest gotcha out there. And quite honestly it's hard for me to advise here based on second hand knowledge, and that leads me into the second biggest gotcha with helmet com systems... speaker placement. I can't tell you how many reviews I've read where people are bitching about the scala riders not being loud enough. I learned early on that most, if not all of those folks just didn't have the speakers positioned right. One big contributing factor here is the helmets with pre-formed speaker recesses in the EPS foam liners. Those are crap. Even my 700$ Arai has them...and they suck. Not only are they not positioned right for my ear holes, they are recessed which means the speakers are not even farther away from my ears. Get a pair of head phones, and pull the cups even 1/8 of an inch away from your ears and listen to the difference.
If you get ANY setup, get anal with the speaker positioning, and make sure they are fastened down inside with some foam behind them to push them ever so gently into contact with your ears...dead center over your earholes. Mounting the ear pieces is the most misunderstood, under estimated part of the whole deal. Don't let someone else do it for you, don't settle for it's good enough, you have to get it dead right, and make sure it's secure enough that putting the helmet on and off won't eventually move them out of place... and DON'T let them push too hard into your ears because they will feel great for about 20 minutes. Just long enough to get on the highway, then they will start to kill you.
So lastly, I'll say the cardo's have done ok by me. I have 5 sets currently. My wife has them in her helmet, and my son has them in his. I also have about 2 generations back g4's, G9's and G9X. The fancy voice activation sucks. The bells and whistles are crap. Basic pair to phone, GPS, and eachother is randy, so don't expect ease of use. But generally speaking, once they are setup, they are setup. Starting G9's you have pc based setup apps and now even a phone app, which I admit, is nice. But at the end of the day, the g4's were fine.
Whatever you buy break your ass to get the mounting done right. Take the extra time to measure your earspots however you see fit, and know that you won't get it right the first time.I'm still trying to perfect the process. I wish someone offered a head molding process to get custom foam cheek pads formed with speaker pockets done right but alas, I'm probably 5 years ahead of the curve with that idea.
I use a Sena SMH10 and been happy with it. I can use iPhone Serie to make phone calls, text, and listen to music.
Cardo Scala Q3 Multiset.
Thought about the Scala 9X but I don't need to talk to that many people while riding. Only major difference aside from that is voice commands on the 9x vice the Q3. Range on Q3 is shorter than 9X.
Works with the Nav 5. Just wish I could control music on the phone via the Nav 5. Perhaps on an upgrade.
Other than that wife and I are happy with the upgrade from the original Q2.
Thought about the Scala 9X but I don't need to talk to that many people while riding. Only major difference aside from that is voice commands on the 9x vice the Q3. Range on Q3 is shorter than 9X.
Works with the Nav 5. Just wish I could control music on the phone via the Nav 5. Perhaps on an upgrade.
Other than that wife and I are happy with the upgrade from the original Q2.
assuming you are talking about bike to bike
I decided to comment on how well I think bluetooth works for bike to bike communications. all of the units obviously have other advantages such as hearing your radio, hearing your phone, gps, and so on. talking on the phone, the noise canceling at least using the SMH10 and an iPhone5s is excellent. Those are all good things as others have mentioned. I was just going to talk about using it for bike to bike.
I have in the past had the Interphone F4, and now have the SMH10 and for a blue tooth intercom it is great.
as for how bluetooth intercoms work as a wireless communications solution. Well, that depends. If you have some good top of the line units they will have really good quality and good speaker volume etc that is a given.
I think bluetooth works best if you are on the same bike or ride relatively close together. when riding with my girlfriend (her on her bike me on mine) (we do ride two up but very rarely) this also works well but when I ride with her we ride slow and we can be quite close together and rarly does the intercom disconnect or get lots of static. The range no mater what they say is in my opinion small. My girlfriend and I rarely get separated by a few trucks for instance but when we do it does introduce static or completely drops it. that said it is very good and being full duplex (like a phone) it is natural to use.
When I am riding with my friends we don't ride as close, for one thing at faster speeds you need more spacing. we are more aggressive and often in the woods as well. either way when their is something between us such as the trees in the bend etc. or just space as we are running at our own pace. this causes static to come across the thing and or it disconnects and you have to do something (depending on make and model) to get them to connect again. this is quickly annoying. the SMH10 is supposed to reconnect automatically and most of the times it does this unless something weird happened or you have been disconnected for a longer time.
A prefered solution to me and some of the guys I ride with is a 2-way radio. as I am a ham radio operator as are some of the guys I ride with then I use my 2-meter handy talkie but a simple FRS radio (costing as little as 20 bucks) is an ideal solution. I realize that most people are not ham radio operators (license required, expensive equipment, legal penalties for cussing, etc) this is where FRS comes in as anyone can pick up a radio and use it.
As for how to talk with the radio while riding for that I use a Sena SR10 which is a little bluetooth enabled device to connect my SMH10 to my 2-way radio. (by the way the SR10 will work with any bluetooth headset not just Sena) so I get the benefit of hearing my music, gps, phone etcetera and having no wires connected to my helmet. All the while instead of connecting the intercom to Rich I just connect it to my SR10 and anyone on the frequency I can talk with. no connect, disconnect, pairing etc.
the advantage hear is also much much grater range. this also alleviates the one brand of device talking only to the same brand. though some of them are coming to the point that they can talk to other brands this is not universal. also no limits to who can be on the same frequency where as I believe my SMH10 is limited to three. and it is PTT (Push-To-Talk) which I prefer, though you can use VOX if your radio has it. I noticed when first riding with Rich actually that I tend to mutter to my self offered kind of under my breath (years of feeling like I am in my helmet with my self I suppose) but the SMH10 is good enough that it picks this up and well it is annoying to me and I must assume it is annoying to others. having the convent button is much better.
Mind you the 2-Way radio solution is Simplex meaning that only one person talks at a time. while talking you don't here what others say. this is actually not a problem and in someways a benefit but you should be aware of it.
By the way the SR10 does not have to be installed on a bike. it has it's own battery and is designed to be portable to use where ever you like. another advantage as I see it.
The short is for bike to bike (other than with my girlfriend, basically puttering around) I prefer the using of a 2-way radio over bluetooth intercom. however in some circumstances the bluetooth intercom works very well and might just be better.
Another note on how the SR10 works, I can connect to it for the 2-way with everyone else but also connect to my girlfriend via the bluetooth intercom (she stays near me and it is always on so she hears my intimate little grunts and things) it is like being at a party but having a private side conversation.
well there is my nickel's worth, here are some links
SMH10 - Sena
SR10 - Sena
my radio setup https://youtu.be/gqQuSHKLLHM
Ritch https://youtu.be/CB7vUWR7SyM
while I am not trying to stump for a brand here as for brands I would have to say that Sena is by far the best software and electronics wise that I have ever come across. I am sure that others will catch up or eclipse them in the next few years, then back and forth, and back and forth and in the end We win! keep fighting for our dollars you manufacturing guys
I decided to comment on how well I think bluetooth works for bike to bike communications. all of the units obviously have other advantages such as hearing your radio, hearing your phone, gps, and so on. talking on the phone, the noise canceling at least using the SMH10 and an iPhone5s is excellent. Those are all good things as others have mentioned. I was just going to talk about using it for bike to bike.
I have in the past had the Interphone F4, and now have the SMH10 and for a blue tooth intercom it is great.
as for how bluetooth intercoms work as a wireless communications solution. Well, that depends. If you have some good top of the line units they will have really good quality and good speaker volume etc that is a given.
I think bluetooth works best if you are on the same bike or ride relatively close together. when riding with my girlfriend (her on her bike me on mine) (we do ride two up but very rarely) this also works well but when I ride with her we ride slow and we can be quite close together and rarly does the intercom disconnect or get lots of static. The range no mater what they say is in my opinion small. My girlfriend and I rarely get separated by a few trucks for instance but when we do it does introduce static or completely drops it. that said it is very good and being full duplex (like a phone) it is natural to use.
When I am riding with my friends we don't ride as close, for one thing at faster speeds you need more spacing. we are more aggressive and often in the woods as well. either way when their is something between us such as the trees in the bend etc. or just space as we are running at our own pace. this causes static to come across the thing and or it disconnects and you have to do something (depending on make and model) to get them to connect again. this is quickly annoying. the SMH10 is supposed to reconnect automatically and most of the times it does this unless something weird happened or you have been disconnected for a longer time.
A prefered solution to me and some of the guys I ride with is a 2-way radio. as I am a ham radio operator as are some of the guys I ride with then I use my 2-meter handy talkie but a simple FRS radio (costing as little as 20 bucks) is an ideal solution. I realize that most people are not ham radio operators (license required, expensive equipment, legal penalties for cussing, etc) this is where FRS comes in as anyone can pick up a radio and use it.
As for how to talk with the radio while riding for that I use a Sena SR10 which is a little bluetooth enabled device to connect my SMH10 to my 2-way radio. (by the way the SR10 will work with any bluetooth headset not just Sena) so I get the benefit of hearing my music, gps, phone etcetera and having no wires connected to my helmet. All the while instead of connecting the intercom to Rich I just connect it to my SR10 and anyone on the frequency I can talk with. no connect, disconnect, pairing etc.
the advantage hear is also much much grater range. this also alleviates the one brand of device talking only to the same brand. though some of them are coming to the point that they can talk to other brands this is not universal. also no limits to who can be on the same frequency where as I believe my SMH10 is limited to three. and it is PTT (Push-To-Talk) which I prefer, though you can use VOX if your radio has it. I noticed when first riding with Rich actually that I tend to mutter to my self offered kind of under my breath (years of feeling like I am in my helmet with my self I suppose) but the SMH10 is good enough that it picks this up and well it is annoying to me and I must assume it is annoying to others. having the convent button is much better.
Mind you the 2-Way radio solution is Simplex meaning that only one person talks at a time. while talking you don't here what others say. this is actually not a problem and in someways a benefit but you should be aware of it.
By the way the SR10 does not have to be installed on a bike. it has it's own battery and is designed to be portable to use where ever you like. another advantage as I see it.
The short is for bike to bike (other than with my girlfriend, basically puttering around) I prefer the using of a 2-way radio over bluetooth intercom. however in some circumstances the bluetooth intercom works very well and might just be better.
Another note on how the SR10 works, I can connect to it for the 2-way with everyone else but also connect to my girlfriend via the bluetooth intercom (she stays near me and it is always on so she hears my intimate little grunts and things) it is like being at a party but having a private side conversation.
well there is my nickel's worth, here are some links
SMH10 - Sena
SR10 - Sena
my radio setup https://youtu.be/gqQuSHKLLHM
Ritch https://youtu.be/CB7vUWR7SyM
while I am not trying to stump for a brand here as for brands I would have to say that Sena is by far the best software and electronics wise that I have ever come across. I am sure that others will catch up or eclipse them in the next few years, then back and forth, and back and forth and in the end We win! keep fighting for our dollars you manufacturing guys
http://www.amazon.com/SHKLXMBT688IL...9QI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1440029799&sr=8-1&keywords=bluetooth+intercoms+shark
I've been using a $100 pair ($50 per intercom) of Shark bluetooth intercoms for 4+ years now, with no issues whatsoever.
Connects my cells, Zumo and passenger intercom easily...her intercom syncs with her phone, pretty simple buttons, and they hold a charge for a long time.
Tiny cable charges off USB. I haven't found anything that it doesn't do that I would have expected it to do.
I am very happy with both the intercoms, and the money I saved
I've been using a $100 pair ($50 per intercom) of Shark bluetooth intercoms for 4+ years now, with no issues whatsoever.
Connects my cells, Zumo and passenger intercom easily...her intercom syncs with her phone, pretty simple buttons, and they hold a charge for a long time.
Tiny cable charges off USB. I haven't found anything that it doesn't do that I would have expected it to do.
I am very happy with both the intercoms, and the money I saved
I use the UCLEAR HBC200 Force. To be honest, I have to say that I'm on the fence about it.
First, after reading all the comments on the net about it had me convinced that it was the best device I could buy. So I did.
Deception number 1, the 2 velcro stickers, they can't seem to stick in my helmet. So placing the 2 speakers in the helmet left me a bitter taste in the mouth about it. To make sure that they stick I had to fix them with a piece of duct tape. :frown2:
Sound quality, is ok. I do understand that while riding I should not expect to have the sound quality of Beats or other brand of earphones but... And as to the songs they all come from iTunes so quality is not an issue for the recording.
Sound quality during a phone call, the comments received from my other parties were not that great. :frown2: complaining about a lot of background noise, although I wear a full face, visor down !
To conclude, I also use the Navigator V GPS. Is it possible that the fact that I have a 3 device ( Iphone 6, Navigator V and UCLEAR) '' Network'' might reduce the sound quality ? And yes, all the software update are up to par for every device.
First, after reading all the comments on the net about it had me convinced that it was the best device I could buy. So I did.
Deception number 1, the 2 velcro stickers, they can't seem to stick in my helmet. So placing the 2 speakers in the helmet left me a bitter taste in the mouth about it. To make sure that they stick I had to fix them with a piece of duct tape. :frown2:
Sound quality, is ok. I do understand that while riding I should not expect to have the sound quality of Beats or other brand of earphones but... And as to the songs they all come from iTunes so quality is not an issue for the recording.
Sound quality during a phone call, the comments received from my other parties were not that great. :frown2: complaining about a lot of background noise, although I wear a full face, visor down !
To conclude, I also use the Navigator V GPS. Is it possible that the fact that I have a 3 device ( Iphone 6, Navigator V and UCLEAR) '' Network'' might reduce the sound quality ? And yes, all the software update are up to par for every device.
I also use Scala Rider Cardo setup. Several years old. I've been pretty happy with battery life. My son and I talk bike to bike and we just went on three day trip, forgot the charger and we talked nonstop for the first two days and the batteries finally died on day three on the last leg of the return trip (900 miles total).
Something i haven't seen mentioned is using earbuds plugged into the phone while using the bluetooth device. When I'm solo, this is the only way to go for me. I have iTunes going, the Scala system blue toothed to the phone, and when a call comes in I can answer with voice activation and the tunes go silent. The boom mic transmits my voice and the caller comes through the earbuds. The sound quality is perfect typically. I've had plenty of people tell me they can't believe I'm on a bike. The other advantage is when listening to route guidance the same music fade-out occurs when directions are being given.
The earbuds I use are Sony Marshmallow buds and they're very comfortable for me but everyone has different ear canals and you'll have to try for a good fit. I went through several different sets before finding the Sonys.
When bike to bike I generally wear earplugs and turn the Scala volume all the way up for voice communication. Not perfect but pretty darned good. The sound quality of the helmet speakers is terrible for music but fine when person to person, hence the earbuds.
Something i haven't seen mentioned is using earbuds plugged into the phone while using the bluetooth device. When I'm solo, this is the only way to go for me. I have iTunes going, the Scala system blue toothed to the phone, and when a call comes in I can answer with voice activation and the tunes go silent. The boom mic transmits my voice and the caller comes through the earbuds. The sound quality is perfect typically. I've had plenty of people tell me they can't believe I'm on a bike. The other advantage is when listening to route guidance the same music fade-out occurs when directions are being given.
The earbuds I use are Sony Marshmallow buds and they're very comfortable for me but everyone has different ear canals and you'll have to try for a good fit. I went through several different sets before finding the Sonys.
When bike to bike I generally wear earplugs and turn the Scala volume all the way up for voice communication. Not perfect but pretty darned good. The sound quality of the helmet speakers is terrible for music but fine when person to person, hence the earbuds.
When my wife and I ride together (on separate bikes), we use a set of Interphone F5mc Bluetooth radios installed in our Shoei Neotec helmets. Interphone makes speakers and boom mikes specifically designed to fit Neotec helmets. They also make them for Schuberth C3 Pro helmets but I haven't tried those.
In the Neotec, the specifically designed speakers are easy to install and are positioned properly. They are close to the ears and centered correctly. Volume can be painfully loud if you turn them all the way up without wearing ear plugs, or if you do use ear plugs they are still very audible. The boom mic is thin and unobtrusive. You won't even notice it's there.
As an intercom, the radios are full duplex, which I prefer, and voice quality is very good. I haven't tried listening to music with them, but have used them to listen to voice prompts from the Nav system, which are loud and clear.
Range seems to be at least a half mile, and more if you don't mind some static creeping in. We have used them for around 8 hours at a stretch without running out of battery charge. I don't know how much longer they would have kept going beyond that. They recharge very fast.
I like that they are physically smaller than some other similar radios on the market. They have been very reliable for a couple of years now.
In the Neotec, the specifically designed speakers are easy to install and are positioned properly. They are close to the ears and centered correctly. Volume can be painfully loud if you turn them all the way up without wearing ear plugs, or if you do use ear plugs they are still very audible. The boom mic is thin and unobtrusive. You won't even notice it's there.
As an intercom, the radios are full duplex, which I prefer, and voice quality is very good. I haven't tried listening to music with them, but have used them to listen to voice prompts from the Nav system, which are loud and clear.
Range seems to be at least a half mile, and more if you don't mind some static creeping in. We have used them for around 8 hours at a stretch without running out of battery charge. I don't know how much longer they would have kept going beyond that. They recharge very fast.
I like that they are physically smaller than some other similar radios on the market. They have been very reliable for a couple of years now.
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